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Flysurfer Peak 4

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jbrodin
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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jbrodin » Sat Dec 04, 2021 9:55 pm

Peter_Frank wrote:
Sat Dec 04, 2021 8:56 pm
jbrodin wrote:
Sat Dec 04, 2021 6:56 pm
What is your experience with the mixertest on the Peak4s?

I did my 4m and 8m today, both needed extending of C by 6+ cms and B by another 3 cm maybe. I have not been able to fly and test yet, but I am curious to hear about your experiences. I have had a bad experience with the long mixertest on my Soul, so I wonder how the Peaks will respond.

Hmmm, this sounds wrong...

Did you make the mixertest when the kites were new?

As I dont believe it can stretch 6-9 cm as you write.

More than 6 cm on the 4 on the bridles only, sounds like a crazy amount - so I have an idea you can not use the mixer test for reference?

8) Peter
Yeah... Ill see how they fly. The amounts written was for the 8m, the 4m about half, say 3-4 cm on C and then 2 cm B.

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby tomtom » Sun Dec 05, 2021 11:28 am

Yes i did normal mixer test /and readjust/ and it doesnt help. It was not very off

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby tomtom » Sun Dec 05, 2021 11:32 am

Maybe we should do collective effort - based on Horst table. There should be usual pattern what happend to bridal and what to adjust to bring performance back. Without full bridal adjustment,which isnt sure to help at the end.

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby tomtom » Sun Dec 05, 2021 11:34 am

It is also possible that performance is lost because fabric porosity. On single skin it should be double as problem as on CC kites.

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jumptheshark
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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jumptheshark » Sun Dec 05, 2021 1:27 pm

Porosity might not equate quite the same. Wouldn’t the main issues with porosity in a CC kite be loss of internal pressure leading to potential shape change while flying and water ingress when crashed where SS don’t have internal pressure except the tip cells and water ingress is already a moot point. SS sit deeper and rely on effaced canopy for shape so you might not see the type of change in performance you get with kites that seek the window’s edge for performance.

I’m sure porosity must degrade performance eventually but not necessarily the same for CC and SS kites. Bridle shrink would likely have more impact on how Peaks fly.

Not sure it’s easy to figure out as bridles will shrink and canopies will stretch. Perhaps just keeping the bridle properly proportioned instead of original spec is the way to go. Figuring out where they shrink most from Horst’s graphic and re stretching a few sections to best preserve overall shape.

jbrodin
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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jbrodin » Sun Dec 05, 2021 3:21 pm

tomtom wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 11:28 am
Yes i did normal mixer test /and readjust/ and it doesnt help. It was not very off
Try to describe the behaviour. If the wing tips fold in you could try to make the B adjuster a bit shorter, if the kite is unresponsive and slow you could make C a bit longer. If the kite back-stalls you can try to make the steering lines longer by moving the knots under the bar floaters.

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby tomtom » Mon Dec 06, 2021 12:24 am

jbrodin wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 3:21 pm
tomtom wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 11:28 am
Yes i did normal mixer test /and readjust/ and it doesnt help. It was not very off
Try to describe the behaviour. If the wing tips fold in you could try to make the B adjuster a bit shorter, if the kite is unresponsive and slow you could make C a bit longer. If the kite back-stalls you can try to make the steering lines longer by moving the knots under the bar floaters.
No, no instability at all. Kite just sits further back in WW and powerstroke is noticable weaker. It is like 15% difference. I control flied them back to back /new old/ on shore and observed power stroke and maximum "upwind", just static on shore. And they behave different.
So i tried reset mixer - but it doesnt help. My kites are one of first Peaks and have some millage :)

Steering wise they are similar. Weird is that while riding older peaks flutters less. Im not talking about wild overpowered flutter but about normal "canopy live" when you push upwind hard.

jbrodin
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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby jbrodin » Mon Dec 06, 2021 8:15 am

tomtom wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 12:24 am
jbrodin wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 3:21 pm
tomtom wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 11:28 am
Yes i did normal mixer test /and readjust/ and it doesnt help. It was not very off
Try to describe the behaviour. If the wing tips fold in you could try to make the B adjuster a bit shorter, if the kite is unresponsive and slow you could make C a bit longer. If the kite back-stalls you can try to make the steering lines longer by moving the knots under the bar floaters.
No, no instability at all. Kite just sits further back in WW and powerstroke is noticable weaker. It is like 15% difference. I control flied them back to back /new old/ on shore and observed power stroke and maximum "upwind", just static on shore. And they behave different.
So i tried reset mixer - but it doesnt help. My kites are one of first Peaks and have some millage :)

Steering wise they are similar. Weird is that while riding older peaks flutters less. Im not talking about wild overpowered flutter but about normal "canopy live" when you push upwind hard.
Have you tried to trim the depower, the Z-row is probably quite a bit shorter than A from shrinking, this could lead to backstall/sitting back in the ww? The next thing I would try is to make the C adjustment 1 cm longer (decrease the loop), to see if this gives a bit more speed/power to the kite.

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby tomtom » Mon Dec 06, 2021 8:30 am

it is not bar problem i have 70cm travel on bar + 10cm trim which is way more than kite needs - I can heavy back stall and heavy "flutter stall". The position where kite goes to most upwind position in WW is like most depowered position without any flutter i for sure can do it. It is bridal or canopy problem. I will try these recomnendations! Many thanks. Just for your info kite is perfectly ridable - it just dont have same performance as new. Its like Peak vs mid aspect cloced cell performance difference but even more "Peakish" if it is understable at all :)

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Re: Flysurfer Peak 4

Postby surfbird » Mon Dec 06, 2021 11:41 am

tomtom wrote:
Wed Dec 01, 2021 10:16 am
Hi, as i have quite few Peaks and some of them has starting loosing shapes and they flies differently than new ones /back to back/ is there some easy method to refresh them? I.E. just lengthen Z or something like that. IMO full reset to factory bridle length will not work because also canopy is stretched. New kites have more power stroke and go upwind better basically which mean better L/D. Im sorry Foilholio is not here, as controversial as he was - he has down to earth bridle understanding.

Many thanks to any answer and also this is encouragement for group effort /Horst xls table etc.../
I've the same feeling. Mine is not as good as they were.
Have you checked the plastic battens in the front?
Mine has started to come out through the seams.

I havn't ridden any back to back, but I'm planning to get the new version when it comes out.


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