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Why do lines tangle when you release safety

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Herman
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Re: Why do lines tangle when you release safety

Postby Herman » Fri May 07, 2021 12:59 pm

Other things for the OP to consider once he gets some experience:

1. Make sure you are using minimum flag length. If your flag line does not have a stopper consider adding one.
2. Use a 5th or mini 5th kite to reduce flag length.
3. If shore line is suitable and flat water consider settling up an anchor, tether land, retrieve and anchor kite to pump leash, pack down lines without flagging.
4. If flat water and light wind, consider walking the lines, transfer leash to kite pump connection and pack down lines at your leisure.

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Re: Why do lines tangle when you release safety

Postby Hugh2 » Fri May 07, 2021 1:24 pm

Herman wrote:
Fri May 07, 2021 12:59 pm
Other things for the OP to consider once he gets some experience:

1. Make sure you are using minimum flag length. If your flag line does not have a stopper consider adding one.
2. Use a 5th or mini 5th kite to reduce flag length.
3. If shore line is suitable and flat water consider settling up an anchor, tether land, retrieve and anchor kite to pump leash, pack down lines without flagging.
4. If flat water and light wind, consider walking the lines, transfer leash to kite pump connection and pack down lines at your leisure.
Herman, how do you add a stopper to existing lines? All my stoppers were put on the line before the ends were spliced/sown. Are split stoppers available that can be added to existing lines?

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Bille
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Re: Why do lines tangle when you release safety

Postby Bille » Fri May 07, 2021 2:12 pm

Hugh2 wrote:
Fri May 07, 2021 1:24 pm
...

Herman, how do you add a stopper to existing lines? All my stoppers were put on the line before the ends were spliced/sown. Are split stoppers available that can be added to existing lines?
A suitable size , SS ring ; will do the job. Push a line loop through the
center of the ring ; then pull the loop, over the ring. It will stay there
with minimal slippage over months of use.

The smaller the SS ring ; the better.

Bille
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Herman
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Re: Why do lines tangle when you release safety

Postby Herman » Fri May 07, 2021 2:39 pm

As Billie said. Or you can also use a stopper ball with very short piece of line with 2 fig 8 knots then larks head the flying line to one of the knots. You can also use a ball on flying line which is then spliced into the fly line.

Having said all that I prefer to keep my lines clean for max strength and least hook ups etc. I don’t even like extensions. You should also adjust for even line length etc.

Therefore I would use the easiest option of ring or ball just to see if it solves your particular problem before doing anything fancy with splicing. It would not be daft to try a ring or ball without evening up the line lengths but if you decide to keep the stopper I would tune the lines.
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Herman
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Re: Why do lines tangle when you release safety

Postby Herman » Fri May 07, 2021 4:19 pm

Hugh, thinking back I think ozone used to splice in a bit of extra line and put a stopper ball up against a double overhand knot in that section of reinforced line. If I am correct their is a picture of it somewhere in the forum, somebody showed it to me because I was surprised they used a knot. Presumably the extra piece of line inserted as a core increases the knot radius and makes up the strength lost. You would still lose a little line length due to the spliced in core section and double overhand knot but it is very neat.

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Re: Why do lines tangle when you release safety

Postby BillyGoatGruff » Fri May 07, 2021 7:27 pm

The warping your lines in a "figure of eight" is a bit of a kiting myth though, there is no benefit to this at all, it just makes it slightly longer to undo the lines:


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Re: Why do lines tangle when you release safety

Postby Matteo V » Fri May 07, 2021 8:32 pm

BillyGoatGruff wrote:
Fri May 07, 2021 7:27 pm
The warping your lines in a "figure of eight" is a bit of a kiting myth though, there is no benefit to this at all, it just makes it slightly longer to undo the lines:

I have had the exact opposite experience.

Anybody willing to try to forego the figure 8 in a hairy tight drift launch?

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FLandOBX
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Re: Why do lines tangle when you release safety

Postby FLandOBX » Fri May 07, 2021 9:39 pm

BillyGoatGruff wrote:
Fri May 07, 2021 7:27 pm
The warping your lines in a "figure of eight" is a bit of a kiting myth though, there is no benefit to this at all, it just makes it slightly longer to undo the lines:

So now we have proof positive that our "experts" can't even begin to properly analyze and test an hypothesis.

If the hypothesis is that we get less tangles with figure 8 wraps than with non-figure 8 wraps, how do we test it??? Of course!!! Our "expert" conducts a race to see which method wraps and unwraps faster!!! The pro kiter beats the amateur in the race, so the tangle hypothesis is undeniably false!!!??? C'mon, Kevin!!! Love ya', dude, but ... really??!! :-?

The reason we get less tangles with a figure 8 wrap is simple. A line running around a bar end in a figure 8 wrap makes a tighter and smaller loop (50% smaller) than a line in a "Kevin-style" wrap. The chance of lines falling off the end of the bar during transport or storage, which is what causes tangles, is much lower with the tighter and smaller figure 8 loops. This is especially important with bars that have flatter ends, which allow lines to fall off easily.

It ain't rocket science. And it definitely has nothing to do with the few extra seconds we lose if we compare our set-up time to a professional kiteboarder's. If speed is the goal, then we shouldn't bungie the line-wraps around our bar ends either. Just sayin'. :lol:

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Re: Why do lines tangle when you release safety

Postby Herman » Fri May 07, 2021 9:55 pm

If you want real speed you could leave the flying lines attached and para pack, just flake the lines down the side of bag not on the bar. I do this on an old blade I use with handles. Can get riding a bug in incredibly short time, easier with short lines but can still turn to rat sh1t on occasions. Kitesurfing I like fig8 winding as per FlanOBX.

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Bille
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Re: Why do lines tangle when you release safety

Postby Bille » Sat May 08, 2021 3:15 pm

Flying the kite, to the edge of the power window , with one tip
touching the water , then flagging it out ; that usually results
in the least amount of tangled lines, for me. I don't like landing
a kite on a crowded beach, with my two fake legs ; I'm not very
stable , when walking on sand, or rocks.

@ Herman :
Where do you do most of your buggying ? I use the dry-lake a bunch !

Bille


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