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Choosing a foil kite

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dave1986
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Re: Choosing a foil kite

Postby dave1986 » Mon Jul 05, 2021 7:26 pm

Turbaani wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 7:21 pm
sonny2727 wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:56 am
With your style of riding and race oriented hydrofoil wings you have a similar setup to mine - I do have the 637 wing so you have the option to add this as well. If I were you my pick is Chrono 13 as this will give you better upwind and less bar pressure - also soul gets overpowered on hydrofoil - not a problem on TT with the massive amount of edging Problem is if you go with Soul or any low aspect kite soon you'd want a higher aspect kite so long term best kite is something like Sonic 3 if you know how to handle. I don't think Sonic is that difficult as the kite is pretty stable.
This is my biggest concern with the fatter profile Soul, if it feels overpowered / draggy in high speeds and I want to upgrade after 20 sessions. Like mentioned before it will only be used with hydrofoil.
Sounds to me like you should choose a Chrono V4. The Chrono is an ideal light wind freerace kite. Lighter than the Soul and lighter than the Sonic. And the Chrono sits between the Soul and Sonic for performance too.

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Nem0
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Re: Choosing a foil kite

Postby Nem0 » Mon Jul 05, 2021 8:20 pm

Have a look at this kites!
Light as a single skin!
Fast turning as your LEI!
https://en.kauper-xt.com/foilkite

Turbaani
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Re: Choosing a foil kite

Postby Turbaani » Mon Jul 05, 2021 8:29 pm


I’ve ridden the W800, it’s a good wing for free race, quick enough and easy to used with big foil kites.
I’ve used the 10 Soul up to about 16 knots comfortably, it will go higher but then water conditions make using a small race wing challenging and I go to my Clouds or wingfoil.
I owned the 12 Soul too, great kite, had it in 15 knots but once again water conditions tend to suit a different set up. I sold it to get the 15 as I wanted to progress my tacks in the lighter air.
The Sonic 15 has the same top end, it’s thinner so handles higher wind. But over 15 knots we get big chop and the crashes at high speed can be nasty. 8-10 knots on any of the kites is the magic zone, smooth water and high speeds.
Hehe sonics top end sounds good. We have really nice flat conditions here if the wind is less then 18 knots. A Rocky bank breaks all the waves and then they split to a bay, so very flat. But never good waves. NEVER :(

Turbaani
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Re: Choosing a foil kite

Postby Turbaani » Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:17 pm

dave1986 wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 7:26 pm
Turbaani wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 7:21 pm
sonny2727 wrote:
Mon Jul 05, 2021 2:56 am
With your style of riding and race oriented hydrofoil wings you have a similar setup to mine - I do have the 637 wing so you have the option to add this as well. If I were you my pick is Chrono 13 as this will give you better upwind and less bar pressure - also soul gets overpowered on hydrofoil - not a problem on TT with the massive amount of edging Problem is if you go with Soul or any low aspect kite soon you'd want a higher aspect kite so long term best kite is something like Sonic 3 if you know how to handle. I don't think Sonic is that difficult as the kite is pretty stable.
This is my biggest concern with the fatter profile Soul, if it feels overpowered / draggy in high speeds and I want to upgrade after 20 sessions. Like mentioned before it will only be used with hydrofoil.
Sounds to me like you should choose a Chrono V4. The Chrono is an ideal light wind freerace kite. Lighter than the Soul and lighter than the Sonic. And the Chrono sits between the Soul and Sonic for performance too.
Chrono is definately getting some votes here. Sounds good. I will check if its available to demo here. Almost noone ride ozone here, can't recall if I've seen a ozone chrono.

I am not familiar with pricing on these kites. What would be considered as a good price for a 13m chrono or similiar sized FS kite?

derek440
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Re: Choosing a foil kite

Postby derek440 » Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:38 pm

Another good option is the Gin Spirit, its lighter than a Soul and slightly higher AR, its probalby more similar to a Chrono V4 but cheaper with same high quality build as both built in the best paraglider construction factories (like Soul).

addictedtofoil
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Re: Choosing a foil kite

Postby addictedtofoil » Sat Jul 24, 2021 2:38 am

I just upgraded to a Chrono v4 11m, and have Chrono V3 UL 9m, and Hyperlink V2 9m. I am 95-100kgs, and ride foiling w800/400 and for boosting big airs 695/400
11m - 10-17 knots
9m 13-25 knots

Chrono's are great, but they don't like gusty conditions (i.e. westerlies in Sydney winter), that's where the hyperlink is better.

I have a Chrono V3 UL 9m and 11m for sale on seabreeze in great condition, selling as upgraded.

Relaunch on the Chrono is more trickier than Hyperlink, however if there is sufficient wind 95% of the time there are no issues relaunching, but I am an experienced kiter. Sometimes I have had to pack kite down and swim in i.e. bowtie etc and you have a short window to decide to pack down or not, otherwise the kite can take on water and sink.

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mede
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Re: Choosing a foil kite

Postby mede » Sun Aug 08, 2021 7:43 am

Anyone has experience with both GIN SPIRIT and KAUPER FALCON?

I saw the Gin Spirit in action this week, looked quite impressive (was not able to demo unfortunately). Read good things about Falcon as well.

Your opinion?

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Re: Choosing a foil kite

Postby sonny2727 » Sun Aug 08, 2021 11:14 am

mede wrote:
Sun Aug 08, 2021 7:43 am
Anyone has experience with both GIN SPIRIT and KAUPER FALCON?

I saw the Gin Spirit in action this week, looked quite impressive (was not able to demo unfortunately). Read good things about Falcon as well.

Your opinion?
Falcon is not aimed for the same target market as Spirit. Spirit is what I call performance freeride something in between Soul and Sonic. Compared to Falcon Spirit better upwind, hangtime. Falcon super stable in UL wind (4-8 Kts) on the edge of the window (many kites are stable at zenith but not on edge in light wind), I have never flown a kite as easy as this in sub 10 kts...light weight makes a HUGE difference.. and anyone experience enough with foil kites will not drop it in the drink. This is my favourite in stupid law wind and gusty wind - side off. BUT you have to handle this kite with care like any true ultra wind kite is (like Pulsion) ...and I don't expect the material to last as long as Soul and this is OK for me as this is not my regular kite and only comes out as a session saver...when the wind picks up i'd be on a soul and then sonic/R1 as low AR kites are boring for my style of rinding until 25kts when Peak 3m comes in with Moses 633...so in sumamry Falcon is a specialist kite like Pulsion for a niche market and its a luxury to own one given the compromise in durability ..I wouldn't recommend this for inexperience riders

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mede
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Re: Choosing a foil kite

Postby mede » Sun Aug 08, 2021 7:00 pm

Interesting points you make.
Not really in line what I read in the German Oase forum though...

Which size Falcon do you own?
Which size Spirit?

mountain_lake
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Re: Choosing a foil kite

Postby mountain_lake » Mon Aug 09, 2021 10:15 am

I can not commend on the Falcon but I own the Kauper Maverick and the Pintxo bar. And I can share my experience with doing business with Kauper which was unluckily not a good one.

TLDR: I bought a Kauper Maverick and realized after the first use that the Kite is losing air. I agreed with Kauper to get it repaired in Switzerland and he will cover the costs, which he didn't do in the end.

The whole Story:
I bought a Kauper Maverick realized after the first use that it is losing air slowly. It was not much so I was unsure if it was maybe just due to the temperature difference from a sunny day to a chillier evening. I contacted Kauper right away that the kite potentially has a leak. I pumped the kite at home and the kite was losing air overnight so the leak was confirmed. Kauper offered me the option to either send it to a repair shop of his choice in Germany or to a repair shop of my choice in Switzerland where I live. I choose the Swiss repair shop in the hope to have the kite back faster and as well to save the quite high shipping costs from Switzerland to Germany.

So far so good, the repair shop claimed he needs 3 weeks as it is the middle of the season. Which I was obviously not happy about, but I accepted. At the same time, I asked Kauper if I can get a discount on the wichard he is selling for all the hassle I had with the kite he sold me. Where he in return send me a wichard for free which I considered quite nice by that time.

A couple of weeks later I could pick up my repaired kite and paid the bill. I forwarded the bill to Kauper with my account details. After about a month I checked my account and realized he didn't pay back my money or replied to my email. By this time I still thought everything was good. So I wrote another email that he please should pay me back the money for the repair of the kite. Where I received at some point an email stating he doesn't know what I want from him. This surprised me a bit, so I resend him the bill and explained that I want my money back. After a bit of exchange, he claimed they can't prove that the kite was faulty from the beginning because I used it already. And therefore he sends me the wichard and we are even now. But, he mentioned nowhere in the beginning that the wichard will be in exchange of the repair costs. Nor did I mention that I want the wichard instead of him paying for the repair. And the cost of the repair was way higher than the cost of the wichard.

When I picked up the kite from the repair shop the guy told me the leak of the kite was not from use but from faulty manufacturing. I told this Kauper and that he should contact my repair guy if he doesn't believe me. At this point Kauper stopped answering my emails, my calls, or SMS. With one final message that he thinks he doesn't owe me anything.


At this point, I started understanding the person Kauper is and the threads in the German Oase forum. Because whenever someone complained about the kite, the bar, or something else. Kauper always blamed it on the user of his product. But with quite plausible explanations so it sounded like he is right. And there I understood, even though too late, whenever someone will have a problem with a product of Rainer Kauper, he will always blame the person using it and not his product. This basically means whenever someone will have a warranty case he will have a hard time with Kauper. And for myself, that means even if his products are cheaper than the rest, I don't want to make business with someone who makes me pay for the repair of a faulty product he sends me.

Maybe this story helps someone who is deciding on buying a Kauper product or not.

Cheers
mountain_lake
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