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From freestyle/big air to old school/big air - gear

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galzohar
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Posts: 120
Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2019 4:54 pm
Style: Freestyle, big jumps and kiteloops.
Gear: Cabrinha FX 2018 14m, 10m, 8m (2020 14m and 10m soon)
Liquid Force Element 2018 142x42.6
Ronix One 2016 size 10 (for Freestyle)
Naish Apex (for jumps and loops)
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Re: From freestyle/big air to old school/big air - gear

Postby galzohar » Sun Sep 11, 2022 10:12 am

I tried both 10m and 9m orbit in winds gusting 25 knots, maybe a bit more. The 10m was a bit more extreme but the 9m was much easier to loop. I feel like overall the 10m will not really give anything in low end from looping perspective (as it might jump higher but loop slower, overall requiring about the same minimum wind), but will lose out on the high end and the increased difficulty to loop properly could make it more difficult to learn tricks. Almost everyone I talked to recommended a 9m over a 10m if its main purpose is looping.

14-10-8 is what I have now for freestyle, for freestyle-focused quiver it's a great setup, but it compromises the looping aspect: A 10m isn't as nice as a 9m for looping, and the 8m doesn't take me very high below 30 knots - Last winter I specifically used it a few times when the 10m would have been fine just to see if I can have just an 8m for looping, and it works but it's not great. It' had been a pretty good compromise, though, when the main focus is freestyle. If I wouldn't quit freestyle I would have replaced my 10m and 14m with 10m and 13m Vegas (I almost bought a 10m Vegas for a great deal but eventually decided to wait and see how my shoulder heals), and regardless get a 9m orbit to compensate for not having a 10m that loops well.

I'm not too worried about resell as long as I can be sure that I'm going to like the kite and not regret my choice. The problem is getting a kite (or board) that is difficult to resell just to realize later I chose the wrong size/model. On the other hand trying to get everything for demo can take a while, so I need to focus my efforts.

For the board, I liked many things about it except the bounciness on the small chop, so I'll try the bigger size and also borrow a friend's 139x42 Jaime SLS to see how that compares. My freestyle board (Radnium) is really tough to beat as it rides really smoothly and has great grip, but it's weight is far from optimal for old school, and its high rocker is not optimal for boosting big at 25 knots (mostly that it doesn't accelerate as much as the big air boards).

galzohar
Medium Poster
Posts: 120
Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2019 4:54 pm
Style: Freestyle, big jumps and kiteloops.
Gear: Cabrinha FX 2018 14m, 10m, 8m (2020 14m and 10m soon)
Liquid Force Element 2018 142x42.6
Ronix One 2016 size 10 (for Freestyle)
Naish Apex (for jumps and loops)
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Re: From freestyle/big air to old school/big air - gear

Postby galzohar » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:02 pm

I used the rebel 13m 2020 today. Unfortunately there is a slight air leak but they will probably take care if it or let me return it. Wind range was 18-22 knots, which was tough to ride, but as I was getting goid jumps in I managed a boardoff first try and later did some nicer ones. Also did some small handless jumps. When the stronger gusts hit (22+ knots) I couldn't jump properly. 24 knot gusts were survival mode (might have been more, the wind meter is in a wind shadow here, especially in the afternoon which gets very gusty). That said, I still need to try it in lighter winds.

I also rode the Jaime SLS 136x41. It is actually different than the Atmos on several aspects. First it was smoother ride, although it might be due to size. Also was a bit difficult to dig an edge at the strongest gusts, but could be due to stronger wind than what I had with the Atmos.
Objectively, the Jaime is somewhat lighter, much less stiff, has a bit less rocker and is more aggressively channeled.
Maybe they deserve their own thread.

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Toby
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Re: From freestyle/big air to old school/big air - gear

Postby Toby » Sat Sep 24, 2022 6:37 pm

what's your weight?

galzohar
Medium Poster
Posts: 120
Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2019 4:54 pm
Style: Freestyle, big jumps and kiteloops.
Gear: Cabrinha FX 2018 14m, 10m, 8m (2020 14m and 10m soon)
Liquid Force Element 2018 142x42.6
Ronix One 2016 size 10 (for Freestyle)
Naish Apex (for jumps and loops)
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Re: From freestyle/big air to old school/big air - gear

Postby galzohar » Sat Sep 24, 2022 7:57 pm

84kg
Most people were riding on 9s and 10s. An experienced friend launched his edge 13m and immediately put it back down to grab a 10. I went in with my Rebel few minutes later and managed, but it wasn't easy.

Also noticed the rebel was stalling a lot when the wind was messing around, was sometimes difficult to make it go to the correct place in tbe window, not to mention throwing a landing downloop. Not sure if it is typical rebel behavior or something wrong. I have a brand new 2023 bar (so it isn't a poorly tuned bar), connected to the "2018 and newer" knot on the bridle (which effectivly shortens the center lines a bit).

galzohar
Medium Poster
Posts: 120
Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2019 4:54 pm
Style: Freestyle, big jumps and kiteloops.
Gear: Cabrinha FX 2018 14m, 10m, 8m (2020 14m and 10m soon)
Liquid Force Element 2018 142x42.6
Ronix One 2016 size 10 (for Freestyle)
Naish Apex (for jumps and loops)
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Re: From freestyle/big air to old school/big air - gear

Postby galzohar » Mon Sep 26, 2022 6:13 pm

At least I learned a boardoff, made 3 jumps with just grabbing the handle and then did a quick boardoff the next one... By the next day managed to do it well enough to get such photos:
original_2022-09-25_Rif_Raf_0474.jpg
I really hurt my writs, though, probably from so much kiting (about 5 hours a day total over 2 days, pushing the top end of the 13m rebel) and boardoffs that I'm not used to do. My wrist got really swollen, hope it's nothing serious. Today was light wind (~15 knots) which would be nice for testing the bottom hand, but I decided to give it a rest so that it can heal...
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edt (Tue Sep 27, 2022 2:34 pm)
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Blackened
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21/22 Orbits
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Re: From freestyle/big air to old school/big air - gear

Postby Blackened » Tue Sep 27, 2022 3:07 am

galzohar wrote:
Sun Sep 11, 2022 10:12 am
I tried both 10m and 9m orbit in winds gusting 25 knots, maybe a bit more. The 10m was a bit more extreme but the 9m was much easier to loop. I feel like overall the 10m will not really give anything in low end from looping perspective (as it might jump higher but loop slower, overall requiring about the same minimum wind), but will lose out on the high end and the increased difficulty to loop properly could make it more difficult to learn tricks. Almost everyone I talked to recommended a 9m over a 10m if its main purpose is looping.

14-10-8 is what I have now for freestyle, for freestyle-focused quiver it's a great setup, but it compromises the looping aspect: A 10m isn't as nice as a 9m for looping, and the 8m doesn't take me very high below 30 knots - Last winter I specifically used it a few times when the 10m would have been fine just to see if I can have just an 8m for looping, and it works but it's not great. It' had been a pretty good compromise, though, when the main focus is freestyle. If I wouldn't quit freestyle I would have replaced my 10m and 14m with 10m and 13m Vegas (I almost bought a 10m Vegas for a great deal but eventually decided to wait and see how my shoulder heals), and regardless get a 9m orbit to compensate for not having a 10m that loops well.
Yes, 9m over a 10m any day. But, if you're in a limited quiver space...

Also the new '23 Orbit 10m loops like a 9.5m :D. I love that kite so much.
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galzohar (Tue Sep 27, 2022 1:24 pm)
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Blackened
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Re: From freestyle/big air to old school/big air - gear

Postby Blackened » Tue Sep 27, 2022 3:12 am

galzohar wrote:
Sat Sep 24, 2022 7:57 pm
84kg
Most people were riding on 9s and 10s. An experienced friend launched his edge 13m and immediately put it back down to grab a 10. I went in with my Rebel few minutes later and managed, but it wasn't easy.

Also noticed the rebel was stalling a lot when the wind was messing around, was sometimes difficult to make it go to the correct place in tbe window, not to mention throwing a landing downloop. Not sure if it is typical rebel behavior or something wrong. I have a brand new 2023 bar (so it isn't a poorly tuned bar), connected to the "2018 and newer" knot on the bridle (which effectivly shortens the center lines a bit).
If most people were riding 9/10s, then it was at least 20kn.

I think you're probably just not used to a forward flying, slower kite. They can shoot out in gusts, so just keep them moving and you'll be fine. If you're coming from the FX to the Rebel, it just flies different and you'll get used to it. The Orbit is a bit more extreme than the Rebel, so get used to it quickly? :D
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galzohar (Tue Sep 27, 2022 1:25 pm)
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Blackened
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Re: From freestyle/big air to old school/big air - gear

Postby Blackened » Tue Sep 27, 2022 3:17 am

galzohar wrote:
Mon Sep 26, 2022 6:13 pm
At least I learned a boardoff, made 3 jumps with just grabbing the handle and then did a quick boardoff the next one... By the next day managed to do it well enough to get such photos:
original_2022-09-25_Rif_Raf_0474.jpg

I really hurt my writs, though, probably from so much kiting (about 5 hours a day total over 2 days, pushing the top end of the 13m rebel) and boardoffs that I'm not used to do. My wrist got really swollen, hope it's nothing serious. Today was light wind (~15 knots) which would be nice for testing the bottom hand, but I decided to give it a rest so that it can heal...
Looking good, mate :). Good work.
These users thanked the author Blackened for the post:
galzohar (Tue Sep 27, 2022 1:24 pm)
Rating: 6.67%

galzohar
Medium Poster
Posts: 120
Joined: Wed Sep 04, 2019 4:54 pm
Style: Freestyle, big jumps and kiteloops.
Gear: Cabrinha FX 2018 14m, 10m, 8m (2020 14m and 10m soon)
Liquid Force Element 2018 142x42.6
Ronix One 2016 size 10 (for Freestyle)
Naish Apex (for jumps and loops)
Brand Affiliation: None
Has thanked: 43 times
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Re: From freestyle/big air to old school/big air - gear

Postby galzohar » Tue Sep 27, 2022 1:29 pm

Blackened wrote:
Tue Sep 27, 2022 3:12 am

If most people were riding 9/10s, then it was at least 20kn.

I think you're probably just not used to a forward flying, slower kite. They can shoot out in gusts, so just keep them moving and you'll be fine. If you're coming from the FX to the Rebel, it just flies different and you'll get used to it. The Orbit is a bit more extreme than the Rebel, so get used to it quickly? :D
Hadn't noticed any such weirdness with the Orbit 9m at 22-28 knots, sure it wasn't an FX and it fell out of the sky when it had slack lines, but it didn't backstall at all. I will have to compare to someone else's Rebel and see, or maybe there is a lack of compatibility between 2020 Rebel and 2023 bar?

tizzleberg
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Re: From freestyle/big air to old school/big air - gear

Postby tizzleberg » Wed Sep 28, 2022 8:17 am

Blackened wrote:
Tue Sep 27, 2022 3:07 am
Also the new '23 Orbit 10m loops like a 9.5m :D. I love that kite so much.
Did you get to try the new 11 too? Should be an even bigger improvement?!


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